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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys,

I contacted Brian H. for a new Control Arm/"banana plate" for 1974 646 project (C21512). He informed me that the part was no longer available and that I should chew on Ingersoll's ear about producing some more. So, I did just that and their response is below.

Thank you for contacting us. I have forwarded your message to Production and Engineering in case there is another number that this subs up to. It probably does not, since our system usually indicates a new part number in those cases. If not, I'll try to send you a schematic of the part so you can pursue having it special made. You could also put word out on www.mytractorforum.com to see if anyone out there has found them available elsewhere.

It sounds like you already have access to parts from various places. FYI, the distributor for your area is O'Neill Associates, 1-800-724-3145, www.oneilloutdoor.com. Please contact them to find current dealers in New Hampshire if you'd like .

Sincerely,

Terry Therrien


So, I ask the pro's HERE what do I do next? Would it be painfully expensive to have one produced from Ingersoll's drawing? Does anyone know if a part from another year is close enough to work? Any input is welcome.
 

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JSB Case said:
Hi guys,

I contacted Brian H. for a new Control Arm/"banana plate" for 1974 646 project (C21512). He informed me that the part was no longer available and that I should chew on Ingersoll's ear about producing some more. So, I did just that and their response is below.

Thank you for contacting us. I have forwarded your message to Production and Engineering in case there is another number that this subs up to. It probably does not, since our system usually indicates a new part number in those cases. If not, I'll try to send you a schematic of the part so you can pursue having it special made. You could also put word out on http://www.mytractorforum.com to see if anyone out there has found them available elsewhere.

It sounds like you already have access to parts from various places. FYI, the distributor for your area is O'Neill Associates, 1-800-724-3145, http://www.oneilloutdoor.com. Please contact them to find current dealers in New Hampshire if you'd like .

Sincerely,

Terry Therrien


So, I ask the pro's HERE what do I do next? Would it be painfully expensive to have one produced from Ingersoll's drawing? Does anyone know if a part from another year is close enough to work? Any input is welcome.
I think it would be an excellent idea to get an engineering drawing for that part. For anyone with access to a CNC plasma cutter it would be a piece of cake to run off a bunch of them and sell the extras on ebay or here. I know of at least one member who could do that but I will let him speak up if so inclined.

In general, if Eastman has no interest in producing parts going forward and is willing to part with the tooling/specs to make those parts then it would be good to get ahold of that stuff. I don't know how Steve Guider got hoods and other parts fabricated for the old tractors but he seems to have sold a bunch.
 

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First thing you need to do is email that person back and let them know that MTF is NOT the only place to go for info. Please foward this site to him so he can pass the word around work there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I just got a follow up email.

Hi,
The engineer may be able to create a replacement kit for the C21512. One of the components he would use in it was obsoleted back in 2000, but we're checking to see if something else can be used instead. If we're able to, we'll let you know the new part number.
Terry


This is better than expected customer service so far. I hope they can get the part produced, but I will do my best to get the drawings as well. (I'll plug the site while I'm at it too.)
 

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Maybe it is just me but I think that you are reading things into those e-mails that are not there. Nowhere did they say they were going to MAKE any parts to solve this problem. What they did say is that they would look at existing parts to see if some sort of conversion kit could be assembled. It would be up to you to do whatever was necessary to install that conversion kit and make it work. Eastman doesn’t have a 1974 644 around that they can do R&D on to make sure this kit works flawlessly. Presumably, they are looking at the foot control that is on the 4200 series to help you out.

Secondly, I wouldn’t be holding my breath while waiting for the next e-mail because their engineering department has bigger fish to fry than the minnow you tossed their way. The suggestion made by Bart was to take them up on their offer to supply you with the drawing and then get someone to run off 50 copies to bring the unit cost down. Getting the drawing costs you nothing. Getting quotes from half a dozen shops to make that part costs you the time involved plus some photocopy fees so you can leave a drawing with them. Once the prices are in, that’s when you make your decision. In the meantime, you can still be waiting to hear back from Eastman.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hydriv said:
Maybe it is just me but I think that you are reading things into those e-mails that are not there. Nowhere did they say they were going to MAKE any parts to solve this problem. What they did say is that they would look at existing parts to see if some sort of conversion kit could be assembled.
"The engineer may be able to create a replacement kit for the C21512."

Hydriv said:
Secondly, I wouldn't be holding my breath while waiting for the next e-mail because their engineering department has bigger fish to fry than the minnow you tossed their way.
Agreed. This is why I mentioned the customer service was better than expected, SO FAR.

Hydriv said:
The suggestion made by Bart was to take them up on their offer to supply you with the drawing and then get someone to run off 50 copies to bring the unit cost down. Getting the drawing costs you nothing. Getting quotes from half a dozen shops to make that part costs you the time involved plus some photocopy fees so you can leave a drawing with them. Once the prices are in, that's when you make your decision.
I think this was pretty clear with my response directed towards Bart's comment. "I will do my best to get the drawings as well." Is it possible that you might be reading into something that is not there? The drawings were never offered, a "try to send the schematics" was offered.

None of this commentary, while entertaining, is getting anyone any closer to the obsolete parts that are needed. :usa2: :wave:
 

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So, where is the original banana plate? I have 3 loaders with those plates, one well used, and I have some trouble imagining how they could wear out. I wouldn't overlook the possibility that whatever issue you are experiencing is not related to the banana plate. Time for a little "true confession" on my part--I was having trouble with the travel control on my nearly new 7020 which has been a bit quirky since new and, sometimes, when on rough ground I couldn't depress the pedal. I figured something was amiss with the banana plate or something related to it and sought some advice from Tom Hanson who told me to do what I already knew I should do--crawl underneath and study the situation. Went a got myself comfortably positioned beneath the banana plate I found everything seemed to be in good order but I still couldn't move the pedal.............could it be that it needed some oil on the pivots? A few squirts from the oil can and I was back in business. Moral of the story is don't overlook the obvious.
 

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I had problem with banana plate it turn out to be bent so anvil big hammer straighten that out this on 646-78. Then still not shifting all way reverse weak took right foot rest off ever thing worked spin wheels at good Idle 1200 t0 about 1400 rpm's. Holes in foot rest drilled in wrong place so left to back bolts out to make work repairs to foot rest still waiting right pedal needed go alway down foot rest.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Bart said:
So, where is the original banana plate? I have 3 loaders with those plates, one well used, and I have some trouble imagining how they could wear out. I wouldn't overlook the possibility that whatever issue you are experiencing is not related to the banana plate. Time for a little "true confession" on my part--I was having trouble with the travel control on my nearly new 7020 which has been a bit quirky since new and, sometimes, when on rough ground I couldn't depress the pedal. I figured something was amiss with the banana plate or something related to it and sought some advice from Tom Hanson who told me to do what I already knew I should do--crawl underneath and study the situation. Went a got myself comfortably positioned beneath the banana plate I found everything seemed to be in good order but I still couldn't move the pedal.............could it be that it needed some oil on the pivots? A few squirts from the oil can and I was back in business. Moral of the story is don't overlook the obvious.
Bart,

The control lever was extremely loose/sloppy when I purchased the tractor. This was a non-runner so I couldn't test its function properly. I decided to replace all of the usual suspects, spring washer, friction washer, banana plate, etc. when tearing down the tractor for restoration. The original plate may be useable, but I figured it would be best to replace it while everything was apart. It sounds like I may have to make the best that I can with what I have. I am doing my best to keep the glass is half full mentality. :thumbsup:
 

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JSB Case said:
None of this commentary, while entertaining, is getting anyone any closer to the obsolete parts that are needed. :usa2: :wave:
JSB,
You presented the responses from Eastman for our review. One of the main directives of this forum is to help members get their tractors back into working order as quickly as possible. As you noted, the part is obsolete and presumably, so is Eastman's communications systems.

It is my understanding that Eastman has no clue as to what is sitting on the shelves of all their regional distributors. Perhaps I am reading too much into their e-mails but I get the impression that they expect you to phone O'Neil's to see if inventory of this part exists. And if not at O'Neil's, then I guess you are expected to phone Rotman's and all the other distributors. If that doesn't pan out, then you can begin to call each and every remaining dealer.

I agree....whether this drawing will surface or not is anyone's guess. Who knows how organized the archives are or whether much of what was at Winneconne actually made it to Maine or not.

The line you referenced said "The engineer may be able to create a replacement kit for the C21512."

Creating a replacement kit is not the same as creating a new part or re-creating the old part. I wish you the best of luck in finding a replacement banana plate.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Hydriv said:
JSB Case said:
None of this commentary, while entertaining, is getting anyone any closer to the obsolete parts that are needed. :usa2: :wave:
JSB,
You presented the responses from Eastman for our review. One of the main directives of this forum is to help members get their tractors back into working order as quickly as possible. As you noted, the part is obsolete and presumably, so is Eastman's communications systems.

It is my understanding that Eastman has no clue as to what is sitting on the shelves of all their regional distributors. Perhaps I am reading too much into their e-mails but I get the impression that they expect you to phone O'Neil's to see if inventory of this part exists. And if not at O'Neil's, then I guess you are expected to phone Rotman's and all the other distributors. If that doesn't pan out, then you can begin to call each and every remaining dealer.

I agree....whether this drawing will surface or not is anyone's guess. Who knows how organized the archives are or whether much of what was at Winneconne actually made it to Maine or not.

The line you referenced said "The engineer may be able to create a replacement kit for the C21512."

Creating a replacement kit is not the same as creating a new part or re-creating the old part. I wish you the best of luck in finding a replacement banana plate.
Apoligy accepted... :sidelaugh: :sidelaugh: :sidelaugh:
 

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JSB Case said:
Bart,

The control lever was extremely loose/sloppy when I purchased the tractor. This was a non-runner so I couldn't test its function properly. I decided to replace all of the usual suspects, spring washer, friction washer, banana plate, etc. when tearing down the tractor for restoration. The original plate may be useable, but I figured it would be best to replace it while everything was apart. It sounds like I may have to make the best that I can with what I have. I am doing my best to keep the glass is half full mentality. :thumbsup:
I think if you replace the bushings, springs, and linkages, etc. you'll find that most of the slop is gone. I'd move on with the original banana plate and save worrying about it until it presents a problem.
 

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The plate is still available for the the 600 series made after about 1980. mikebramel wrote this in another tread here I think good info because I have 3 numbers for that part. c17555 c22986 c48638 at price old quote of $74.00

If you do need new control arm (banana plate) use newer 600 numbers like 25801 control arm also reqs. c29765, c29603.
 

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nevermind, doesnt come with the ball joint. it comes with a bushing, for the ball joint, which is c19025, the follower that slips in the cam plate is c23514

I also needed
C29765 WMT- SUPPORT, TRAVEL GUIDE/SWITCH MT 600'S

C29803 WMT- TRAVEL CONTROL ROD (600'S, 6,7000'S)
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Another email from Eastman with some hopefully good news.

Our engineer is setting up part #C48640 which will replace C21512. This new part number will contain various hardware items, a travel control rod weldment, a cam assembly with bushings and a support control weldment. We don't know the list price yet. Accounting will assign a price after the bill of materials is entered in our system.

Terry


The price might be scary...
 
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