case 222 belt/clutch issue?

3260 Views 14 Replies 6 Participants Last post by Bart, Jul 27, 2011

ken222

Discussion Starter · Jul 26, 2011

I have a new to me case 222. Brought it home from the previous owner with the deck on it, used it and it worked fine, the clutch engaged/disengaged just fine. I removed the deck to change the hydraulic oil, i put the deck back on and now the clutch wont disengage. do i have the adjustment for the belt too loose/ too tight? first time doing this so i am really not sure how tight is too tight. I undersatnd the 1/8 gap on the spring and it is there now, do i need to go more?

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

Hydriv

· #2 · Jul 26, 2011

The belt tension should not have any affect on whether the clutch disengages or not. What you report is bizarre to say the least but co-incidences do exist. It almost sounds as though something is jammed in the clutch disc area and is keeping the clutch engaged. I hate to say this but you may have to dismantle the clutch and check all of the parts. I suggest that you start by going to our Tech Library/Service Manuals section and locate the CLUTCH manuals. I don't know which clutch you have but the manuals will help you to determine if you have the older shim clutch or the newer EZ Adjust model. Please review those manuals and compare your clutch to both styles. IF you have a large hex nut just behind the fan, then you have and EZ Adjust clutch.

You mentioned that you changed the hydraulic oil. What brand and type of oil did you put back in?

ken222

Discussion Starter · #3 · Jul 26, 2011

15w-40 delvac, was on sale at orielly auto for $9.99 a gallon. regularly $16.99 sale ends 7-28 if you need some. It's a 1973 but i have the EZ adjust. I am definitely a newbie and learning a lot.. i have been reading manuals non stop learning, but i am definitely a rookie. Previous owner had hydraulic fluid in it, so i changed that. Mybe you can help with this too. If you leave the TCV in the same spot how much loss of speed should i encounter going up a hill say 15 degree angle for about 25 feet.

Hydriv

· #4 · Jul 26, 2011

ken222 said:
15w-40 delvac, was on sale at orielly auto for $9.99 a gallon. regularly $16.99 sale ends 7-28 if you need some. It's a 1973 but i have the EZ adjust. I am definitely a newbie and learning a lot.. i have been reading manuals non stop learning, but i am definitely a rookie. Previous owner had hydraulic fluid in it, so i changed that. Mybe you can help with this too. If you leave the TCV in the same spot how much loss of speed should i encounter going up a hill say 15 degree angle for about 25 feet.

The oil choice is just fine.

We are all rookies of varying levels of "rookiedom" :sidelaugh: I hope that I never stop learning something new and I am confident that is exactly what is in store for me. I have yet to meet another enthusiast that claims to know it all but I have run into a few people on forums that think they know it all. :lol:

A further oil change at the end of the season would not go amiss to help purge more of the incorrect fluid from the system. No panic to do this and no harm will come from leaving it in. This is all about ground speed and how oil viscosity and stability plays into that. If you are running the tractor's engine at full throttle while ascending a hill in Lo Range, then the loss of ground speed should not be all that noticeable. But if you are mowing in Hi Range at 3/4 throttle, then that's a different story.

Speed loss can be attributed to one or more factors.

- pump wear

- motor wear

- travel linkage wear

The issue is whether the loss is a pain in the ass or not. When it gets to that stage, then diagnosis is necessary.

Begin by checking the RPM of the engine at full throttle. If you are not spinning at 3600 RPM, then you are not getting everything you can out of the pump.

A gauge set up plus some instructions from Bart or myself on how to use that gauge, will disclose what the max amount of pressure your pump will put out. Now, perhaps the pump is at fault but a weak spring in the relief valve will also reduce available pressure.

Perhaps a new pump is needed. Perhaps a new relief spring is needed. Perhaps an adjustment to the relief valve will solve that part of the problem.

Examining all the parts in the travel spool's control linkage and removing every scintilla of free-play will ensure that the spool is moving the full distance in the valve body thus sending 100 percent of the pump flow to the motor. The motor's RPM is based on that flow.

If all of the above have been addressed and the problem persists, then the motor must be evaluated. New motors from newer, parted-out tractors may solve that problem for less money than paying a shop to rebuild it.

See less See more

ken222

Discussion Starter · #5 · Jul 26, 2011

Again thanks for the reply. I am in low when this happens just about wide open throttle. I done have a tach so i'm not sure exactly what the rpm is. I have access to gauges and ability to have hoses or hard pipe fabbed up so i could very easily find out what my system psi is. where is the best place to insert the gauge? I will take at the TCV when time permits, are the TCV's rebuildable or throw aways? Any pump and motor rebuild kits available? any that you suggest. I have time as its not a pain in the butt yet, however i am by nature a tinkerer and am always trying to make the tractor better. My main focus as of this time is going to be figuring out what happened to my clutch. It worked fine , then i took the deck off, now it doesnot disengage.

Rockdog

· #6 · Jul 26, 2011

Going uphill with travel lever in anything but full forward/reverse willl result in speed loss. The amount depends on how little flow is going to the motor, how steep the hill is, and the pump rpm. Mine slows significantly if it isnt in full forward. This is normal as far as I'm concerned.

If you overtighten the drive bent siginificantly I suppose the return springs between the hub and clutch disc may not overcome the friction between hub bearing and shaft. It would be worse if the hub bearing wore a groove in the shaft in the engaged position.

Bart posted a thread before and hopefully I'm quoting it right - I think he said the spring gap should be the thickness of a dime for j-46 decks and two dimes for later ones???? I set my J-46 to one dime and it works fine. An 1/8" seems pretty excessive to me.

Hydriv

· #7 · Jul 26, 2011

ken222 said:
Again thanks for the reply. I am in low when this happens just about wide open throttle. I don't have a tach so i'm not sure exactly what the rpm is.

Low cost tach's can be bought off e-Bay that use a reflective strip that bounces light back. Just do a search under "digital tach" and pick your poison.

I have access to gauges and ability to have hoses or hard pipe fabbed up so i could very easily find out what my system psi is. where is the best place to insert the gauge?

On the underside of the travel/lift valve, there is a hex-shaped pipe plug that uses an Allen wrench to remove it. This is the test point and the drain plug for the system. You need a glycerin-filled gauge that will read at least 3000 PSI.

I will take at the TCV when time permits, are the TCV's rebuildable or throw aways?

Rarely do travel control valves need any attention and when they do, usually new O-rings is all that's required. However, the relief valves for the implement lift as well as the one for the travel spool are located in the valve body. These too, rarely need attention unless a pump that is known to be good is in the tractor but the pressure is low.

Any pump and motor rebuild kits available?

Pumps cost less than $230.00 and are not worth trying to rebuild. Motors rarely need attention and when they do, then that work is best done by a Pro.

I have time as its not a pain in the butt yet, however i am by nature a tinkerer and am always trying to make the tractor better.

Removing any free play in the linkage that controls the travel spool is a worthwhile effort when you have the time.

My main focus as of this time is going to be figuring out what happened to my clutch. It worked fine , then i took the deck off, now it doesnot disengage.

There is no magic answer to your clutch problem. This is a journey of discovery and enlightenment. The manuals along with the dismantling of the clutch will likely be the only way to get to the root cause. The main shaft must not be badly grooved. The bearings must all turn freely. All parts must be in the correct order and quantity. Getting a clutch adjustment that will hold, depends on all the clutch parts being in good working order and adjusted properly.

ken222

Discussion Starter · #8 · Jul 26, 2011

Thanks for all the replies, by the way the TCV is all the way forward when i go up the hill. i will get a gauge and see what i have as far as psi. I'm sure i'll have more questions , keep you posted

Bill.H

· #9 · Jul 27, 2011

Hydriv said:
On the underside of the travel/lift valve, there is a hex-shaped pipe plug that uses an Allen wrench to remove it. This is the test point and the drain plug for the system.

What size is that hex? I don't have an Allen wrench that fits and I figure I'll pick up a 3/8 drive one rather than buy a whole set.

Hydriv

· #10 · Jul 27, 2011

I've never actually looked at the wrench size that I've used but I think it may be 1/4". A 3/8 drive socket style is the best way. Just make sure that the hole is totally clean and that the wrench is inserted full depth.

ken222

Discussion Starter · #11 · Jul 27, 2011

well guys i figured out the problem, i am missing a couple of .050 spacers and spring washers for the setup. which is causing .0000 gap between the clutch pad and plate. any idea where to get them?

Hydriv

· #12 · Jul 27, 2011

Go to the FAQ's section and locate the document that tells you about members who are also dealers. Brian Hildreth's contact info can be found there. If you call Brian, he will put the shims into the mail today.

CASE 220/4

· #13 · Jul 27, 2011

ken222 said:
well guys i figured out the problem, i am missing a couple of .050 spacers and spring washers for the setup. which is causing .0000 gap between the clutch pad and plate. any idea where to get them?

Make 100000% sure you are referring to the CORRECT diagram of the PTO clutch. There were two different style pulleys used for the friction disc on these tractors and you must determine which style you have before you go and try to figure out which spacers are needed. I am in the middle of refurbishing one at the moment and will be posting pics of it later this week. I have both style pulleys and I will post them both so you and any other member here can see the visual difference on them. This will make it a lot easier to determine which set of spacers are used on the clutch.

ken222

Discussion Starter · #14 · Jul 27, 2011

there is 2 different pulley/clutch disk spacer combinations for the EZ clutch? whats the difference?

Bart

· #15 · Jul 27, 2011

ken222 said:
there is 2 different pulley/clutch disk spacer combinations for the EZ clutch? whats the difference?

One has a shoulder where the friction desk is mounted, the other doesn't.

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.