[Mr onetwo]

I was hoping Bob M or 1 of the other engine experts could answer this question.Brian Miller and others say to use non-detergent SAE 30W in the Kohler, but the Case and Kohler factory literature clearly state that 30W detergent oil is to be used...what do you guys say.I picked up some det. 30W @ NAPA yesterday because the ND has no ratings and says not to use in modern engines.I am confused :facepalm:

 

[Bob MacGregor]

I only use non detergent oil for breakin of a new or rebuilt engine. This lets the engine run in and seal up the small leaking areas. I may do this for up to 30-40 hours with several oil changes before I switch over to the recommended oil type. Detergent oils have a strong cleaning characteristic about them particularly synthetic oil. Non detergent oil is getting more difficult to find as time goes on.
Bob MacGregor in CT :mowlawn:

 

[Hydriv]

I have a lot of respect for the knowledge and skills of Brian Miller but I disagree with his notion on this issue. The purpose of a detergent is to dissolve contaminants and keep them in suspension. Normally, this was done so that a full-flow oil filter could remove those contaminants down to a specified size (micron) and keep the oil fairly clean. Kohler K's do not have oil filters so in order to keep the oil clean, the owner must change it every 25 hours of operation maximum.

If owner's do not adhere to that schedule, then the contaminant level in the oil will continue to build and then it becomes an abrasive mixture that begins to cause accelerated wear. This becomes a domino effect. The more wear that takes place, the more the oil becomes contaminated and that accelerates the wear.

Perhaps Brian's point is this. If you use non-detergent oil, all those contaminants will just settle on engine parts or in the bottom of the oil pan and they won't be circulated in the oil. Sounds like a good plan, right? The downside to this theory is this. Those contaminants will not get flushed out during an oil change so they will stay behind as an ever-thickening coating on the inside of the engine. Yes, these are called air-cooled engines but you cannot dismiss the fact that the oil itself must be cooled as well. The only way that the oil will get cooled is if it can come in close contact with the engine block and pan.

Those are my thoughts.

 

[Mr onetwo]

Thanks for the info guys...I really appreciate it! :thumbsup: I think I will use Pennzoil 30W... I have always had good luck with it. Do you guys have any opinions on using a little Kerosene mixed in the oil before a change to help flush things out....just curious :mrgreen:

 

[Hydriv]

IMO, there is no need to add kerosene or anything else to the oil. Change the oil while it is hot. That's the secret.

If you want to do something good for your tractor, install an hour meter if you do not have one. Then keep your eye on it and change that engine oil every 25 hours or slightly sooner. The 30W is OK during plus 32F temps. Do not use it below that number.

 

[Bob MacGregor]

DO NOT ADD KEROSENE!!!!! :facepalm:
Using the engine manufacturers recommended engine oils and grade changes for temp changes and oil change intervals is the best deal.
Mad Mackie in CT :446:

 

[Mr onetwo]

I promise I won't add Kero :lol: Thanks for your input. :thumbsup:

 

[robynrj]

Group
Back in the 50's/60's most all oil was straight weight and non-detergent. If your 20/30 yr old eng has always used non detergent keep using it......putting in a detergent oil now may "clean" stuff behind rings etc that are keeping them in contact with bore. If rebuilding, break in as MadMac suggest w/non detergent, then switch to STRAIGHT weight detergent if you want. Bob M

 

[Rockdog]

Thought detergents will tend to foam. Doesnt seem like you'd want that in the applications we're talkinga bout here.

 

[Hydriv]

Detergent oils contain anti-foaming agents. That's one of the reasons that Shell's Rotella T is heavily recommended for the hydraulic systems of these tractors but it is available in straight grades too that are very suitable for air cooled L-head engines such as the Onan and Kohler models used by Case

I agree with the notion of staying with a non-detergent if the engine has been using that oil type for many years. Putting a detergent oil into an engine like that will mean that the detergent will begin to cleanse the interior of the block and the oil will become heavily contaminated very quickly. So if you don't keep changing that oil out every few hours of operation, you will be constantly be circulating an oil that is highly prone to do serious damage to the engine.

 

[Rockdog]

Why do they contain anti-foaming agents?

 

[Hydriv]

Why do they contain anti-foaming agents?

Because you do not want your oil to be whipped into a foam.

Foam is a word that equates to air bubbles. Air bubbles can be compressed and hydraulics cannot work properly when air is present in the oil. Air gets squeezed out of the way in pumps and motors to allow metal to metal contact that accelerates wear on the moving parts. Foamed oil in a hydraulic cylinder causes a loss of control over the movement of the piston because the oil acts like a spongy substance instead of a solid substance.

 

[Rockdog]

That was my point. Anti-foaming agents arent 100%. Non-Detergent oils are still available. Tractor Supply has it. I'm sure there are others.

When we partical count (count number and size of particulate in fluids to determine if the oil is cleaned out all the way) it has to be done at 200 PSI or higher or we end up counting bubbles.