[Hops_Farmer]

So there I am pulling my 6 foot disc harrow when all of a sudden I feel the tractor start to lurch. Then smooth out. Then lurch. Oh shit! I look at the front end and see oil pouring out. I limp it up to the barn, pushing the travel pedal as little as possible. I see a trail of oil behind me on the ramp, then the puddle starts to form. I took off the grill and saw the carnage. There was oil all over the bottom of the oil reservoir and everything in the vacinity of the pump. I noticed a steady drip coming from this area in the picture.

I wiped everything down as best I could with a few rags to see where it was coming from. I checked all the hoses and they seemed secure. I fired it up and watched as there was a steady drip coming out from under the pump. Then noticed there was more fresh oil on the underside of the reservoir again.

I was pulling the harrow with a total of 10 16"x8" and 2" thick patio blocks on it in low range in 4WD at about 60% throttle. Was I working it too hard or was this going to happen no matter what? Do I buy another pump? A new one or used? How much to rebuild a pump?

And worst of all the harrow is now sitting in the middle of the garden! What a day...

 

[Hydriv]

No..... you weren't working it too hard.

If the harrow was too much for your tractor, then the relief valve would open up and squeal like a stuck pig and the tractor would not move. Let's not jump to conclusions here. You need to figure out to a certainty where the oil is leaking from. You may have a blown hose.

 

[InTroubleAlltheTime]

Hops my friend you are having a rough week. As Tom said I would really double check that area and rule out other system leaks. When I had an issue with my 646 I really wiped things down and checked and double checked, but in my case I did determine it was leaking from the seal where the shaft came out. The motion of the pump shaft was spraying hydraulic fluid all over the place. I hope it's something simple in your case and not the pump itself. And be careful.
:222: :446: Best Regards, Rich

 

[Hops_Farmer]

I hope so too. Should I try to remove the pump, or should I start with removing the hoses? When I start the tractor it drips from the bottom of the pump in a very steady way. Can I damage the system if I let it run dry while I am trouble shooting this? Should I tear everything out and check it or is there a simpler way to do this?

 

[Bart]

You don't want to be running the engine with no oil in the reservoir as it can damage the pump. I'd take off the tin around the pump coupling and clean off the hoses, etc. as well as you can. I usually use a pressure washer to clean things up prior to trying to locate oil leaks as it makes it a lot easier to see where they're coming from. Use safety glasses to make sure you don't inadvertently get oil spray/drips in your eyes. Run the engine at low speed and start looking for the source. My guess is that if the oil leak volume increased suddenly it's probably not the pump, more likely a hose.

 

[Billygoat]

DO NOT USE YOUR HAND(S) TO FEEL FOR LEAKS! The potential for high pressure oil can maim or kill. I had my finger hit with a 2500 psi pressure washer. I doesn't fell well at all. Luckily it was water and not oil. My finger was twice the size of normal for over a week where it "filled up" with the water. Dr. said it would be ok as the body would absorb it, and it did. If it had been oil, it would have been extremely bad and could have lost my whole hand. It all happened faster than you blink an eye.

 

[Hops_Farmer]

DO NOT USE YOUR HAND(S) TO FEEL FOR LEAKS! The potential for high pressure oil can maim or kill. I had my finger hit with a 2500 psi pressure washer. I doesn't fell well at all. Luckily it was water and not oil. My finger was twice the size of normal for over a week where it "filled up" with the water. Dr. said it would be ok as the body would absorb it, and it did. If it had been oil, it would have been extremely bad and could have lost my whole hand. It all happened faster than you blink an eye.

My father tells the story of watching some old mechanics looking for a pinhole leak in a big machine using a straw broom. They would wave the broom around where they thought the leak was and when they found it the straw from the broom would be cut away from the pressure. He's told me enough horror stories to give me a healthy respect for high pressure. We are lucky these things use regular oil. Some hydraulic oil has ricin in it. That stuff will kill you quick.

BTW, I hope your finger is better!

 

[99flhr]

Consider just cranking the engine with the plugs out, sometimes make it easier to follow the trail.

 

[Billygoat]

Finger is fine, that happened about 5 years ago.

 

[Hops_Farmer]

I got mad at my tractor today. I tried to find the leak, but couldn't. So I tore it apart. I tried to catch all the oil, but made a mess. I disconnected all the hoses and checked them for leaks, nicks, or cuts, but couldn't find any. There was a flat spot on one hose where it pressed into the frame. I flexed it at the point where it was flat, but didn't see any cracking. After some digging around I decided to just tear it all apart.

Here is the result.

On a side note, I was surprised to see that the muffler is only supported by the exhaust manifold. Now that I have easy access to it, would now be a good time to sand and paint it?

I did some looking around online and almost fell out of my chair when I saw what these pumps go for. I am hoping my connection for hydraulics can hook me up on the cheap.

If anyone has a spare one of these laying around feel free to send it my way. Does anyone know if this pump was used in other tractors? I have a lead on a 446 that has no engine, but its 5 hours away.

 

[gator_rider2]

I did search on number on that pump here link to some reading and brakedown way thing look inside. A kit should be available for your pump.

http://www.mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?p=1313462

tonight I do more searching for you.

 

[Hydriv]

You need to learn how to control your emotions, Hops. :facepalm: :facepalm:

What you have done is the WRONG way of going about getting to the truth of what's behind this problem. :thumbdown: :thumbdown:

Hydraulic hoses can develop leaks that are not detectable just by looking at them. You have to put them under serious pressure in order to find the leak or validate that the hose is OK.

As for your pump, the same thing holds true. Pumps get tested on a Flow Bench machine that spins the pump, applies pressure and measures the GPM and Pressure the pump puts out at various RPM's. Seems to me, the pump in your tractor is a dual chamber pump. It has one chamber for the Power Steering and a larger one to propel the tractor. You can expect to pay upwards of a $1000.00 for that pump from an Ingersoll dealer but why would you jump into another pump until you know positively that this one is defective? The best advice I have for you at this point is to take your pump to a hydraulics shop that has a Flow Bench and get it checked out. If your pump is leaking, the test will locate the leak. If it is repairable, the shop will advise that. And no....... you cannot substitute a pump from a 446 or any other GT into your tractor. Those are all single chamber pumps.

 

[Hops_Farmer]

Headed to the hydraulic shop in the AM for a bench test. After all this work I kinda hopes it fails!

 

[Hydriv]

Headed to the hydraulic shop in the AM for a bench test. After all this work I kinda hopes it fails!

After all that work, I hope that your pump checks out just fine in all respects. I wouldn't wish a failed pump on anyone with a 7000 Series tractor.

 

[InTroubleAlltheTime]

Hops: I would plastic bag all exposed hoses and also protect the ports on the pump from any dirt during transport. Especially the exposed hoses if you are going to work on the muffler. I use zip lock sandwich bags and plastic tie them. Then I just cut the ties with scissors when I put things back together.
:222: :446: Best Regards, Rich

 

[Hops_Farmer]

I dropped the pump off at Complete Hydraulics in Plymouth, ME. They took a look at it and said they could see that the shaft seal looks like it blew out a chunk. He said the shaft seal you can see is only rated for 10 or 20 PSI. So if it did blow out something else has blown out too. They also got me a price on a new one from another manufacturer. It was $817 and another $80 if I wanted the actual Parker pump. To add insult to injury they said the lead time was 6 to 8 weeks. They will open the pump and diagnose it for free. If they find something busted they can get parts, but I am still looking at 8 weeks. If there is nothing wrong with it, they still have to get the seal kit to put it back together. Grrrrrrrrrrr!

Rich: Good call on covering the hoses. I am going to use tin foil. When I was in the Army they used to use it on all the inlets for the Blackhawk engines. I think they used duct tape too!

 

[Hops_Farmer]

Now that I have this all torn apart, is there any services you can think of I should be doing? I am going to change the hydraulic oil filter only because I have the system mostly drained, but other than that what should I do?

 

[Hops_Farmer]

I got my first quote on a new hydraulic pump. $550 for a new parker pump. I am going to wait to hear what the rebuild will cost.

 

[gator_rider2]

Hopefully kit or new pump come with vitron seals way better Buna-n seals. I would use wait time set up pressure Guage so relief can be set on new are rebuild.

 

[Hops_Farmer]

Hopefully kit or new pump come with vitron seals way better Buna-n seals. I would use wait time set up pressure Guage so relief can be set on new are rebuild.

How on earth do I do that?