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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I will start slowly posting my Case 446 with diesel swap here which I'm going to call the Super 446. I'm currently half way through the build but I'll start from the beginning and post a little bit at a time until I'm at the current state of the build.

So a bit of background, I got into Case tractors this past summer. With the help of this forum my son and I 100% mechanically restored a 1988 446. That is our mowing tractor. We went over it top to bottom, and besides paint.... it is basically brand new like it was from the factory with the exception of a few mods like the TCV linkage and factory looking led headlights. It is a wonderful tractor and is quite amazing how nice it mows and how quiet it is while it mows.

So moving forward, this past summer I needed to remove a tree stump in my yard and my powerstroke F250 would not even budge it. So I rented a kubota BX23 with loader and backhoe. That little diesel tractor was absolutely amazing, but the $20k price tag was now. After the tree stump was removed, I no longer needed a loader or backhoe on my property but still wanted a diesel tractor.

In comes a excellent condition one owner 1982 446 that I drove 4 hours one way to Virginia from Pennsylvania to buy. It came with a plow and tiller. The gentleman who owned it said his father bought it brand new in 1982 and used it till he died in the mid 2000's. He himself never used it but it was in amazing condition and came with a book full of records and receipts for everything that was done. So definitely a good score.

So the plan is to completely redo the '82 446 and make it better at least in my opinion. I love to tinker and have the necessary skills and knowledge to do so. I know there will be naysayers but I honestly don't really care as it is my tractor and I already have a stock 446 to do things the Super 446 can't but it won't be many things. Please don't take this the wrong way, as this is a hobby and passion of mine always tinkering and making things better.

So here's the start of my 1982 Super 446.

I started with completely stripping it and cleaning everything. Nothing real special here but as I put it back together I started to replace little things that needed it and fixing little things as I went.





I put on some new Firestone tires all the way around. The fronts are the 16x6.50-8 tri-ribs from Miller tire. The rears are 8-16 Firestone Regency. I like these tires for the fact they aren't as steep of an angle on the bars and bite a good bit better in dirt. I do kind of wish I would have went with 9.5-16 but I still can down the road and put these on the '88 446.

I cleaned and the reamed the front spindles for a nice smooth turn. They were extremely gunked up with old grease. I also drilled out all the grease fittings and tapped them for 1/4-28 fittings. I also did the poor man's power steering on the front with parts from McMaster Carr.

The pivot pin was replaced on the front axle. I also did this on my '88 446, but on the Super 446 it still had some slack. I'm not sure if I want to try and fix that and how I'd go about it. Carefully slicing the frame from the bottom up and then pull it tight with some clamps, then rewelding it would probably fix the slop left but I'm not sure if it is even worth messing with.

What have some of you done to fix the excess slop on the front axle? It isn't much but with my OCD it bothers me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Yes that is the pin that I replaced. While it helped quite a lot to pull it tight, the channel itself the front axle is in, it is still sloppy on the left and right sides of the frame. It is almost like when they welded the frame that day, they got a little carried away with pulling it tight to the frame cutout.

I'm not sure what you're referring to for "primer remover".





 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
It's already in and there will be no major cutting or hacking to be done. I am not keeping the front pto as I already have another 446 for mowing and anything that would use the pto can be ran hydraulically. One planned attachment is to use a 44" deck and drive it with hydraulics. It will be setup like a 3 point brush hog.

Also the entire hydraulic system is getting redone, which has mostly been done already as well.

I just haven't posted that far into the build yet but will tonight.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Ok so to bring this post close to current, I will start the engine portion.





I will be using a Yanmar 3tne68 3 cylinder diesel. I came across it locally for $400. It was a sailboat generator. The generator portion shorted out and they pulled it from the sailboat.



Two reasons why I jumped on this.... well three. #1 it was cheap lol. Most engines like this go for $1500 to $4000 bucks used in various conditions. #2 it only had 500 hours on it. The interior of the engine looks brand spanking new. It's honestly truly unbelievable how clean it is inside the motor. #3 being a generator it was set to run 1800 rpm. So no young kids reving the crap out of it, or doing stupid stuff. It lived a nice quiet and easy life in the bottom of a boat.





The reason I went diesel is well.... I wanted too.... and more power. The 3tne68 runs around 20hp and can make more. I do plan on eventually running a turbo. It is 784 cc weighs about 175 lbs and turns the normal 3600 rpm. John Deere used this same engine in a 2500 and 2653 greens reel mower. They also used the identical block but smaller cc 3tn66 and larger cc 3tna72. They are the same exact engines just with smaller and larger bore and strokes. These were used in the 330 332 430 455 655 755 855 and many others. I honestly didn't know JD had so many small tractors with the same diesel engine.

Before anyone says the hydraulics can only use so much power blah blah blah..... I understand that. That is with the stock hydraulic system which I will NOT be using. The only two items staying stock are the TCV and the hydraulic motor. Either way I will address this in a future post on what I'm doing for the hydraulic system.

Anyway... the 3tne68 fits in better than you could ask. Everyone says it can't be done without butchering the hood and lengthening the frame. This is simply not true. THERE WILL BE NO CUTTING THE HOOD AND NO LENGTHENING THE FRAME. That was my absolute #1 rule for this build. It must appear stock. I don't want a hack job. I want this tractor to look like it rolled off the assembly line with a diesel.

The 3tne68 oil pan sits nicely down inside the frame rails. I will have to weld a drain on the bottom of the oil pan. It is currently on the side in the frame rail and inaccessible. The flywheel will sit down into the frame perfectly as well at the lowest point. I do not plan on cutting any clearance as it will be unnecessary.



With changing the thermostat housing, I was able to have about 3/8" hood clearance. So that's even better.



Now two things you don't see in the pictures.... #1 I will not be running the front pto drive and #2 the mid lift cylinder is being changed out for a john deere cylinder. You can see the mount I've already welded in the cross brace for the mid lift cylinder. By changing the mid lift cylinder it allows me to safely run more hydraulic pressure and a stronger built cylinder than OEM. I've also gained a inch of stroke to 4" instead of the Case 3". The rock shaft will have to have the mounts cut off and rewelded on the bottom to clear the oil pan.

The one problem will be is the brake pedal. It will have to be cut off inside the dash tower. I am unsure yet how I want to go about addressing that. I have a few ideas but until the engine is mounted, I'm not going to do anything yet. I'm thinking about notching the dash tower possibly or making an arm that slips inside to keep the original function of the parking brake and travel lever release.



Here are a few more pictures of it sitting in the frame. I have a good 8" from the water pump snout to the front of the grill. This is with shifting the hood forward a bit but you can't even tell. The hood still overhangs the dash roughly 3/8" and still looks nice. This might not be permanent. I'm going to use a Austin Mini radiator and that will be here the end of the week. So depending on thickness and mounting the oil cooler, the hood could very possibly stay in the stock position. It all depends on a fan.















So from what I'm seeing with other diesel swaps (which there are very few) the kubotas are larger in length and width. The yanmar is taller but that was negated by it sitting down in the frame rails. I've just seen a few kubota swaps and there was definitely hood and frame cutting. So maybe that is why everyone told me it couldn't be done, but with this yanmar...... you can see it most certainly can be done.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thank you everyone for the compliments!!!!!

I'll use this post to address all the questions and then later tonight I'll post where I'm at with the hydraulic system.

Dundee- As for no front pto and mid lift... yes I do want to retain original functionality with the mid lift cylinder to do a few things. I want to possibly keep a plow on the front all the time. The case plow is actually pretty heavy duty compared to most other brands. I have the new style designed in fusion 360 but I need to find a place to laser cut and bend the brackets. I also would like to possibly run a middle blade like a road grader with tilt and pivot as well (hint to the 3 spool valve on the drivers side). So keeping a cylinder tucked up on the engine close to the original position will let me do that without have to redo everything. I do not plan on a loader at this point. If I was going to do a loader I think I'd just find a case loader and go that route instead. The Super 446 is going to stay more along the lines of a traditional farm tractor.

Bob- I have seen your post and do have it book marked. Your setup is something I have definitely considered. One thing I forgot to mention was I do want to do a individual rear brake setup. The website and posts by a gentleman named gator I believe is gone but I have started to source parts for it. So that might be a good way to go for the brakes.

Vigo- I will post more of the hydraulic system so far later tonight.

Ddude- I will definitely just be doing the rear hydraulic pto and maybe a front at some point as well. Not sure what I'd use on the front but you never know. That could be done two ways, off the 3 spool valve or just make up some lines off the rear pto valve. I don't think I'd run some front and back at the same time but who knows.

As far as frame reinforcements I do plan on doing something. I haven't seen anything on the rear of the frame, could you post a link? As for the front I have seen numerous failures while researching. My plan of attack is two fold. The diesel block is a very stout structure so what I plan on doing is kind of like a Farmall tractor. The engine will be part of the structure along with the frame rails.



I'm going to make a plate that will drop down in the notch where the Onan sat. It will get welded front to back and will hold the engine like a cradle. Then I'll have two flanges on the each side of the rear to bolt to the starter plate. The starter plate is roughly 1/4" and will work just like a engine mounting plate in say like a racecar.

Then I also would very much like to make a one piece plate that will run from front to rear. It will go over and around the front axle reinforcing that and the front attachment mounts as well.

Then on the bottom of the frame will be a flange, basically making one larger piece of angle iron front to rear. The only place it might cause an issue is around the brake drum. That side might have to be split into two pieces but I think it can be done.

It would be nice to tie into the 3 point plate as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
So the main advantage to the Case tractors (as we all know) is the true hydraulic system. It is a great start to all kinds of custom attachments. What I'd like to do is have all attachments run hydraulically.

The one main thing I want to build using a 44" deck (that normally would go underneath) into a 3 pt brush hog. I have my '88 446 for normal mowing but I have a few areas on my property that is semi rocky with weeds and crap growing. Also my neighbors have a line of pine trees dividing our properties. The trees are on his side but have grown on my side and they won't trim them so there is all kinds of crap growing under them and I don't feel like driving my nice tractors under them to mow. So this will help by backing up under the trees. Aren't neighbors so wonderful?

A few other things are the stock tiller, a box blade with hydraulic top link cylinder and a hydraulic cylinder on one of the 3 pt arms for tilt. Depending on how the box blade works maybe a belly blade like a grader. I'm also thinking about a 3 pt bucket like @Lionel did on his tractor. That attachment is quite amazing. He has some amazing fab skills.

So starting from the beginning of the hydraulic system, let's start with the pump. I'm going with a SAE A pump for a more robust pump than the Uber expensive factory pump. I am going to step up on volume but not a lot. I'm thinking the .85 cu in pump from surplus center. That will be bit more than stock but nothing to crazy. Plus I'll be able to control the flow as I'll explain further in this post.

I have designed the lovejoy coupler in fusion 360 and just need to get it machined. It will bolt directly to the crankshaft sandwiching the flywheel. It will register off the flywheel just like the flywheel centers on the crank. I'm also stepping up to a L110 lovejoy due to the extra power and torque using lovejoy's safety factor. The pump connections will remain factory and in roughly the same location.







Next moving on..... all hoses were replaced with 100R17 hose rated for 3000 psi working pressure. The only factory lines still being used are the steel lines from the TCV to the motor. 5/8" hose for everything under pressure, and 1/4" hose for the mid lift and 3 pt cylinders. All hoses are also being covered in MSHA rated sheathing. Moving right along..... next in line the rear pto valve.

Now the tractor came with a rear pto when I bought it. Knowing that I was changing stuff around and also knowing the seals for that valve are super expensive, I sold it. I went with a chief valve that I added a 3 position detent on. The chief valve also has a power beyond port. That is a added bonus that I really wanted to feed the 3 spool valve on the dash tower. Agricultural quick disconnects were added to the rear pto valve.





Next the outlet for the rear pto goes back up the left frame rail to the flow control valve mounted on the left side of the dash tower. I cut a hole in the left side foot board just like the right side to aid in running the hoses cleanly out of the way. It then comes out of the flow control valve and goes right under to the TCV.







So as you can see I upgraded to the integrated holding valve and sold separate holding valve to save space. This did require me to move the mounting holes back about a half inch for the TCV. I also rebuilt the TCV with new seals and gaskets. From the photos above you can also see the returns tee'd for the mid lift and the 3 pt cylinders. I'm not sure if I will keep it this way or not. The TCV I'm using has the hole on the side tapped for a return so I could use that as well to keep the returns more separate than just a T on the bottom. I believe this port was used on early power steering tractors for a return but then was moved away from using it. It is also the power beyond port for the 6000 and 7000 tractors if machined for from the factory.

From output side of the TCV lift circuit, the hose runs up to a manual splitter valve. This isn't quite the same as other valves as it is a 3 way I'd call it. It can be just the mid lift all the way to one side. Then the 3 pt all the way to the other side BUT if the valve is right in the middle, it will still work both at the same time which is awesome. Never know when that might come in handy. So the lift lever in the dash will still control both the mid lift and the 3 point depending on the splitter valve. I did cut away some of the one panel to nicely run the hose around it to the rear cylinder. This cutout also gave me more space for the feed and return hoses to the rear pto valve.





The rear hydraulic cylinder was replaced with a john deere cylinder capable of 2000 psi and 4" stroke. JD part #AM147175 AM121141. I used the later as I got a good deal on it from ebay. Both cylinders are the same one just supercedes the other. They are 2.5" bore and 4" stroke. They are a touch longer than the Case cylinder but the rod can be redrilled to bring it damn close to stock length. I will also have to redo the mount as the bottom is completely different than the Case.

The mid lift cylinder is JD part# AM116154. It is also a 2.5" bore and 3.875" stroke and rated for 1000 psi. Now this will not replace a stock mid lift. I completely cut out the stock cross member. I moved it forward on the frame to account for the extra length and made the new cross member out of 1/4" angle. I don't think the stock cross member was even 3/16".... more like 1/8" maybe.

Now the reason both cylinders were replaced is because in my research I've read numerous times about pressure spikes in the system with the splitter and working forces on the return side. So I did what others have done and replaced both cylinders problem taken care of. Now I can also tweak the pressures higher for a bit more grunt as well.

Then the cherry on the sundae is the 3 spool valve on the right side. I knew I wanted more hydraulic circuits on my tractor. I did not want to run multiple splitters so this is how I went. Now this would require you to figure out a different way to tap into the pressure side. With my rear pto valve having a power beyond port, this was easy. I haven't ran any hoses yet but it won't be hard to run a 5/8" pressure hose to it.



The 3 spool valve has three spring to center spools with one of those having a float detent. One spool will go to the front for power angle of the plow. I will probably run some nice hard lines up the side of the frame with quick disconnects on the front like the john deere tractors. The other spool will go to the rear for the hydraulic top link on the 3 pt. This will be awesome especially running a box blade and even a plow for easy quick adjustments on the fly. I can tell you from experience a hydraulic top link and a box blade really works excellent together and makes the box blade much more functional.

The third with the float I think will be for a hydraulic lift arm on the 3 pt. This really isn't necessary, again it is just me playing big tractor on a small budget lol. It will allow tilting of the box blade for say a road crown or drainage on the side of road or garden. It just a little something extra to play with that's all.

The only thing not figured out yet is the return lines from the flow control and the 3 spool valve. I'll have to wait till the motor is mounted to see how the stock return will work or not work. I'm hoping to at least get it out far enough I can weld to hose barbs to it. That way the flow control can loop up over the engine and down to it and the 3 spool will be a straight shot to it.

Now as far as a cooler.... that will all have to wait till the radiator shows up and see how much room I have.

I've been debating on running a aftermarket fluid cooler for say like a racecar. I'm not sure if those will handle the flow of the system or not, I'm thinking not so I'm hoping the oem cooler will work.

I wonder if the 448 or loader coolers work any better than the 446 cooler. I do have a oil temp gauge to run and monitor the system temperature at the reservoir.
 

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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Looking great so far.

If you feed your 3 spool from the pto's PB, won't that mean that no oil flows back up to your flow control and then on to your TCV? I thought you'd have to feed your TCV from the pto's PB.

Bob
Yes you bring up a good point which I forgot to mention. The 3 spool valve will be a closed center. This will not let it flow any hydraulic oil until one of the spools is used.

As you said if it was an open center all the hydraulic oil would just go the path of least resistance straight back to the return circuit via the 3 spool valve.

Talking to some of the engineers at the place I used to work, running the closed center should be fine. The only time it will see a high pressure would be when the tractor is really lugging down driving. Even then the the system has been upgraded to handle this pressure. So instead of the rear pto being the higher master pressure relief, it will now be the 3 spool valve. Then the rear pto valve set a little lower, then the TCV being a little lower yet.

As of right now the only foreseen problem could be is cylinder creep. Depending on the quality of the 3 spool valve, I may get a bit of cylinder creep under high pressure. This could be remedied by either a higher quality valve or a complete hydraulic shut off valve to the 3 spool.

One thing you could be correct about is which valve gets the return and power beyond on the rear PTO. I maybe have to switch them as of right now the return goes to the TCV, the power beyond goes to the 3 spool. So depending on which circuit gets priority, they maybe have to be switched so the tractor doesn't stop while using the 3 spool. I don't care if the 3 spool is a little slower as it is just for cylinders. I however do not want the tractor to stop while using the 3 spool.
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
Interesting mods!

Got a question.. am i right in thinking this handle could be rotated to pull front/back? Might be slightly more intuitive that way if used for the top link. I can't tell from the pic if it would interfere with the next handle's silver 'body' or not.
View attachment 127835

Hydraulic top link.. yes! Once you have used a power top link with a box blade you'll never want to touch a box blade without a power top link. Like if i told someone i used my box blade for this or that and they said "can you get on my tractor and show me what you're talking about" and they didn't have a power top link, id be like.. ehhhh.. let's change the subject lol.

I used an electric-over-hydraulic cylinder for mine on my small Kubota B6100. I bought two of them with the thought i'd put the other one on my Case but have not done so yet. Obviously real hydraulics is the way to go if you've got the valves and plumbing all planned out. I have thought about a 'tilt' link but haven't talked myself into it yet. Seems like a lot of hassle for something i wouldn't use that often, plus it would practically have to have a load holding valve or inline cutoff to keep from 'drifting' all the time. What i HAVE spent a lot of time thinking about, is modifying my next angle blade for tilt, manually. I don't have as much desire to tilt my box blade.

As far as the 3pt mower, I like the idea but i think a 'conventional' 3pt mower won't get you as far under a tree as you might like. If you extend it far enough rearward your tractor, with no loader, would need a ton of front counterweight. Going back to my b6100 (only a bit bigger than Case) with an FEL, 4' bush hog is no problem. On a b7100 i have (same basic tractor) with no loader, same bush hog plus 3x55lb weights up front, still does not have a lot of steering authority.

What i think might be a better idea in your case, since it would be hydraulically driven, is to front mount this mower. Maybe make it able to use the same lift mechanism you'll be building for your plow. The tractor is already heavier at the rear, plus the 3pt can pick up another 500+lbs, plus your head is further from that end of the tractor. If you draw a line from the top of the mower deck to the top of your head with the 3pt design, it really only gets you 3-4ft further under a tree before hitting your head on branches, than a mid mount mower! Draw the same line in the front and it's more like a 5-6ft difference, plus you could make the thing 'extendable' if you wanted. Something like a 2.5" square tube nested inside a 3" square tube, with a couple of crosspin holes, could make it extend by several feet pretty easily. If it extends AND angles up far enough on the lift mechanism, would also make it pretty easy to do blade repair/maintenance. And heck, you could still put 3pt brackets on it and use it that way too. Or maybe this is just too much scope creep. 😂
I already tried to rotate the valve, unfortunately it doesn't have any threads to do so and the one you see in the picture is a set screw for something internal.

As far as the top link yeah I can't wait.

I've also thought about making it work front and rear for the mower deck and is a very good possibility I will do so.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
I would love it if you would post a couple pictures of the dashboard, thanks
Here's two. Let me know if there is something different you'd like to see.





I started this tractor before the diesel swap was considered so the oil temp gauge will probably get moved to a pod on the steering column. A water temp gauge will go next to the tachometer then. I'm not sure then if I'll run an oil pressure gauge or boost gauge yet either. A pyrometer would also be a good idea as well with the turbo. Oil pressure I could just run a liquid filled gauge right off the side of the engine block too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Radiator came in today. I had a Kubota radiator but it barely fit in the grill. So without major surgery it was a no go.

The current radiator I have is from champion radiators and is for a Austin Mini. I'm hoping since it will cool a 850cc to 1275cc 4 cylinder it will work for my 785cc 3 cylinder.

It was suggested by a few guys on Facebook who have done diesel swaps. It fits great in place although I wish it was a little bigger. The only other options at this point without majorly cutting the hood and grill are a race Mini radiator that has a thicker core, a full custom radiator or the addition of a engine oil cooler. So I guess I'll have to wait and see how it does once it is running.



I'm doing some engine work tomorrow so once it is back together and in the tractor I'll know what I have to work with for a fan.
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
So been about a week since I have been able to do any major work on the Super 446.

I pretty much finished up the engine. The only things I have left to do is rebuild the injectors and adjust the valves plus do a compression test for a base line. I tore it apart to a short block just to check everything because it was sitting in a warehouse for several years after it was pulled from the sailboat. I'm glad I did..... there was a lot of sludge in the oil pan which I'm just going to assume it was from sitting. There were spots left on the cylinder walls from where the pistons sat in place. You can't feel them but you can see them.

Otherwise the inside of the engine is immaculate and really does look like it only has 500 hours on it like the hour meter said.

I did have to clean/rebuild the entire fuel system though. The diesel dried in place and the injection pump was stuck. I unfortunately broke the rack to move it into postion so I could remove it from the block. I took it all apart soaked everything in acetone, cleaned it all up and reassembled it according to the service manual. Doing this myself saved at least $500 from what a few shops quoted me. I never did any major diesel work before but it really isn't nothing major or anything to be scared of. Follow the manual and as long as you have a decent mechanic background you should be fine.

Unfortunately the injectors are stuck too. I have them apart, and cleaned.... gonna give it a whirl to put them back together once the injector tester gets here. I may have to replace the needle assembly in each, guess it depends if they'll hold pressure or not. Manual says they need to hold 1650 psi for 10 seconds with out leaking. They pop at 1700 psi. New needle assemblies are $94 each from John Deere but a new injector is $195. There are tons of options all over the internet and eBay but I'm pretty sure three injectors for $100..... yeah probably garbage.

Anyway the fan came today. The motor is in its final resting place and thankfully everything will fit and I can keep the hood in the oem location which is great. It won't look weird at all. The only cutting I'll have to do is where the frame gets taller in the rear where the Onan originally sat. The brake pedal is definitely gonna have to be reworked but I'd rather that than moving the hood around and looking weird.

Lots of room in there between the fan and pulleys. So far I'm extremely happy with how everything is fitting. I just need to design the mounting plates and get it tacked into place. Then I run the fuel lines and add a return line to the fuel tank. Then I can test fire it!





 

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Discussion Starter · #41 ·
So as far as a shroud goes, I see what you mean now when you said your fan just about covers the radiator. That electric fan is built into a shroud. So as long as you have a small or no gap between that plastic shroud/housing and the face of the radiator, then you're getting full flow through your radiator equal to the area of that fan shroud.

So in your case, you could eke out a little bit more efficiency by adding a full rectangular shroud. But I'd be shocked if what you have doesn't work perfectly.

I was thinking this whole time you were just going to be running a fan off of the engines water pump or some such. With that electric fan integrated into that plastic shroud will do a great job.

And while I'm at it, everything else you've done to this point just looks top-notch. You're really doing a job to be proud of.

Bob
Yeah I'm running an electric fan. I wanted the simplicity of a mechanical fan but I wasn't sure on space and then also like you said the cowl around it would be extremely weird because the fan is so much higher than the radiator core.

The plan right now is to have my sons votech class make a arduino controller for the fan. I want the fan to do more than just turn on and off at preset temperatures.

With a relay module that is PWM capable and then a arduino programmed will control the fan. It will come on at say 185° and run at say 50% rpm. Then slowly ramp up to say 75% rpm at 200° then full 100% at 210° or so. This is just an example for temperature settings as I'm not sure what I want them set at yet. I do know I want the fan to vary rpm depending on temperature.

Also taking this one step further, I want the arduino to also operate off the hydraulic oil temperature as well. The problem with this is a engine running will just keep getting hotter and hotter and hotter. It really doesn't have to correlate to load or working the engine although those both will effect the temperature.

The hydraulic system is pretty much load/work dependent. With the engine idling or say mowing grass, the oil will mostly run the same temperature to a certain extent. However if you're plowing or say tilling or using the rear pto, basically working the hydraulic system it will then keep getting hotter and hotter.

To do this it could be done one of two ways.

One would be run another fan and arduino. This would be the simplest way but I don't have the space to run two fans with out major modifications.

The second way would be to program the arduino to control both. It would take readings from two different temperature sensors. One in the hydraulic system and one in the coolant system. So which ever reaches the set temperature first the fan would run.

Now the only problem with doing it this way is it could negatively effect the engine temperature by running to cool if the hydraulic system needs cooling first. The hydraulic system doesn't really matter, the cooler the better. However running the diesel to cool can effect performance. How much is really unknown. You might not even notice it.

I will say last year the thermostat failed in my '06 powerstoke towing my camper around this time of year. It failed open so there was no control of the engine coolant temperature. Normally towing my camper (9500 lbs) in the summer it runs around 210° up to 230° pulling mountains in PA. After the thermostat failed, the truck was only running around 140° and it hugely impacted performance. It was a dog, and I don't believe running efficiently burning all the fuel. So I don't know lol.

So that is the downfall of cooling both systems at once.

There is also a third option however I'm not sure I want to venture down this path as it is quite expensive and could possibly not work correctly.

A heat transfer setup..... so basically it would be a large tube and inside that large tube would be a bunch of little tubes that the hydraulic oil would run through in its own circuit. Then in the large tube, there would be engine coolant. This would separate both systems however there are two potentially huge problems with this.

First from all of my research, it seems the temperature of the Case hydraulic system runs around 200° or so when really working these tractors. So if running a heat transfer setup..... will it even cool the hydraulic oil enough if the engine runs around 180° to 200°? I could see this being a benefit in the winter but a problem in the summer. What is the temperature difference of hydraulic oil going in and coming out of the oil cooler? I haven't tested this yet so I don't honestly know if it would be enough cooling to do it.

The second problem is it could very well overtax the small radiator I have.

A lot of unknowns to try. Most heat transfer coolers run several hundred bucks. It would also be a lot of work to try making one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #42 ·
I ended up doing the same service to the fuel system on my Kubota diesel and the injectors I got were cheap-o Fleabay ones and I ended with 2 of 3 working and the third one wept a small bit of diesel when it ran. I ended up paying about $120 for 4 injectors at the end of it all so they aren't too bad, they're super simple as they're just the fuel nozzle with what is essentially a pressure operated check valve. Only picky thing on the injectors on mine is the two halves of the injectors determines their pop off pressure so if they're assembled wrong they won't work right. If you plan on rebuilding them I would 100% get the nozzle tester, they aren't to expensive and save you a ton of headache in the long run. Looks like you got a gem of a motor though, should be plenty sturdy after you get it going!
Yeah I haven't looked into it to much yet but I have ordered a tester. Gonna give it a whirl. I know my injectors pressure is set with shims. I don't know if the two halves have to be set a certain way or not yet.

I have for a few places that sell remaned injectors anywhere from $75 to $200 each and some have core charges as well. John Deere uses these same injectors and pressure settings on a dozen or more machines. I would hope John Deere injectors are genuine yanmar but who honestly knows.
 

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Discussion Starter · #44 ·
So I apparently missed a word or two in that post... how tight together the two halves of the injectors are determines the pop off pressure, I assume it's pre-loading the spring in the check valve within them so it releases at a given pressure which is determined by the torque applied to the top half on the injector when installing it to the bottom half. Your shims probably work the same way as mine just uses a copper crush washer instead.

I read your controller deal for the cooling system and as it seems like a neat idea what you need to look at is if the motor for the fan can handle what you're wanting to do, not all motors like PWM control unfortunately. Also, the tube and shell heat exchanger for the hydraulic system would be good but would have to be quite large as the hydraulic fluid is moving pretty fast and would either need to be slowed down through the cooler or the cooler would have to be extremely long to compensate and provide any reasonable efficiency. I prefer Engineer's Edge or Engineer's Toolbox for some calculation help on things like that. (Engineering Page > Heat Exchangers, thermal calculators and information) Heat transfer and fluid and thermal systems like that are very picky and require some serious design consideration to be properly effective. For me I'd rather upsize the stock radiator or just use the stock radiator as your fan will be pulling way more CFM than the stock mechanical fan which will increase the cooling capacity. If you run some nice Rotella synthetic oil in the hydro system you'd be dangerously close to or will be melting the aluminum fins on the cooler before the oil starts to break down.
Yeah I plan on running 5w40 t6 rotella in this 446. It's the same stuff I use in my 6.0 powerstroke. I'm probably gonna switch the '88 446 hydraulic oil to 5w40 t6 as well just to be covered for the winter. The Onan burns a bit of oil so I'll probably keep that regular 15w40 rotella.

As far as the cooling I'm just gonna stick to what I have now and see how it does. That's all I really can do till it is running.
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
So as much as i like an elegant implementation, i think you might be overthinking fan control. I would venture that you would be totally fine with on/off. Let the actual thermostat do the 'metering' and have the fan just be on/off. The only thing that i would say is too simple of a switching circuit will have it click on and off repeatedly when near the set point. Something that actually turns it on and off at different temps would be better in that sense.

As far as the hydraulic cooling, I have NO fan on my Predator 212-repowered Case 444, and i have not 'overheated' the hydraulics. However, it is purely a push/pull machine and i don't do any PTO anything with it.

Is there any room between the front of the hydraulic cooler and the grille?
I believe you may be correct to get started and see how it actually works. Sometimes the KISS method is best. And yes I'd use a fan controller to kick on and off but off would be lower than the on setting.

There is a little bit a room in front. Maybe an inch or so.
 
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