[animalsonly]

Ok I am going to do my first engine pull and tear down. I have a Kohler 14hp that I want to bring in for possible valve, block, cam and crank work. I would like to know what specialty tools I will need to do this. Like gear pullers - size, spring compression pliers, or ring pliers. If they bore it out and do cam work will they know what size to make them for standard replacement parts? Will they give me the sizes I will need for the replacement piston and rod. What gaskets will they need to rebuil these parts? I know this sounds dumb but I am a beginner at this.

 

[Hydriv]

Here is the very first thing that you need. And the good part is that it is free. Either park it on your hard drive or download it to your printer.

http://www.kohlerengines.com/onlinecata ... p_2379.pdf

Unless you intend to make a career out of engine rebuilding, then there is no need for you to purchase all kinds of specialty tools that may see one-time usage. Take apart the engine with common, ordinary, every day tools that any mechanic would own and leave the specialty stuff to the machine shop you select to perform the work on the block.

If you own a digital camera, you should use that to document in pictures, how the engine looks as you tear it down. Another trick is to make a step by step document of which item you removed from the engine first, second, third and so forth. Doing that is like leaving a trail of bread crumbs on a journey so that you can find your way back home again.

And if you so desired, you could use this thread to show the photos and describe how a 1st time engine rebuilder went about doing this and what he learned as a result.

 

[BushBoneYard]

Great ?. This has always been in the back of my mind. I would also be a beginner at a tear down project and have wondered about tools......

 

[Billygoat]

The only "special" tool needed would be a Harmonic balancer puller to remove the flywheel. DO NOT POUND ON THE CRANKSHAFT WITH A HAMMER!,no matter what any body else says. Use the puller to put as much pull on it as the puller will handle, then a sharp rap on the puller with a hammer will remove the flywheel if it isn't already off from the puller itself. I think it's Autozone that will "rent" you one for free. You pay full price for the puller and then take it back when done. They then return your money. Personally I think if you don't already own one you should just buy one. They aren't very expensive at all and come in handy quite a bit. The only other "special tools would be a set of feeler gauges to check and set end play on cam and crankshaft, and a good torque wrench. You can probably "rent" that from Autozone also, but there again I would just buy my own. I own two high dollar ones now, 3/8ths and 1/2" drive, but I used Craftsman for years with no problem. I still own the Craftsmans and they still work great. Those are the ones I let my sons take home to use. Never know if they will return, know what I mean? :sidelaugh: Keep us posted and don't be afraid to ask questions, lots of knowledgeable people here and glad to help.

 

[mastifflawyer]

Harbor Freight has the puller we use on sale now for $9.99...

http://www.harborfreight.com/46-piece-b ... 37824.html

 

[Hydriv]

Harbor Freight has the puller we use on sale now for $9.99...

http://www.harborfreight.com/46-piece-b ... 37824.html

Do they offer a lay-away plan?

 

[animalsonly]

Ok. Just ordered the puller. It will be 3-7days to get it. I see rebuild kits on e-bay but they come with a piston and rings. Unless the cylinder can just be honed then that kit won't help me any. Unless I take the gaskets and re-sell the piston and rings. Great advise on the digital camera suggestion. I had already planned on doing that along with taking notes. One other thing for others who are watching this, mark the directional positions of things befor you take their pictures. Sometimes you can never have enough referance points.

 

[Billygoat]

Should have the bore mic'ed first along with the crankshaft. The machine shop could tell you what size oversize on the piston/rings and undersize if needed on crank to order. Be aware though, I just had my K321 bored. Initial micing indicated .010 oversize. The friend that did the boring for me is extermely anal about the work he sends out the door and ended up going to .020 before he was satisfied. It may be better to order parts after "rough" boring is done, then get parts to finish final hone to match piston. I've read that fitting isn't necessary but it doesn't hurt to be sure. There are kits on E-bay that are inexpensive and have had good reviews. The Gentleman that sells these kits offers all standard over/undersizes available, and I have heard that he will exchange parts if wrong size was ordered. (before installation of course). Also be aware there is a thrust washer on the shaft under the governor gear assy. It's very thin and may be kinda stuck to the block. Make sure you get it out and keep it with the gear assy. It can be missed very easy, I found mine because somebody else lost theirs. That's when I went and found mine still on the shaft. From what I understand they are about $4.00 for that little washer! Keep us posted.

 

[Hydriv]

First you pull the engine and dismantle it.

Then, after finding a shop you can trust, you take them the block etc so they can measure the taper of the cylinder, how worn it is and how out-of round it is.

Once you authorize them to perform the machine work on the parts, they will tell you what oversize piston you need and what undersize rod you need. If you think that an engine as old as yours that already smokes badly, will get away with a honing and a set of rings.... I think that you are dreaming.

You and I can speculate all day long on this issue but the machine shop results will tell the truth as to what needs to be done. Who knows? Maybe your engine was bored out previously and now you need to sleeve that block in order to save it.

There is an "order" which all rebuilding must follow. If you deviate from that order/procedure.... you end up regretting what you did because it always costs you more money.

 

[mikebramel]

Plastic scrapers to clean up gasket surfaces
3/8" Dial Beam torque wrench, only $20 or 30 at sears
Feeler gauges/dial indicator to set the end play
Plasti gauge to check the crankpin clearance

 

[animalsonly]

Thanks for calming my nerves on the ordering of parts. I am now understanding the flow of the process. Like I said I never did this before so I will be asking a lot of goofy questions. I saw all the kits on ebay. It Looks like they are OEM parts. Are those ok? I will order when the machine shop tells me what to get. I'll supply them with the parts they need and use the rest of the kit on my part. Look for my goofy questions posts on the forum.

 

[Billygoat]

I don't think you can ask any goofier questions than I have, so don't be shy. :lol:

 

[Mr onetwo]

I would suggest going to Brian Millers excellent site.....http://gardentractorpullingtips.com/engine.htm Tons of great info on the Kohler single. And by all means, keep asking the "goofy" questions...it means that I won't be :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[bob_hefley]

I would suggest ordering the rebuild kit first. I have ordered numerous rebuild kits from ebay seller bakt4kids. Always great service and quick delivery. The only reason I suggest ordering first is because some of the kits he sells are metric. .010 over piston is .25mm over piston. The machine shop I use (Wilkerson's in Springfield, IL) wont bore a block without piston and rings. They just want to make sure piston to wall clearance is correct.
Just as an extra precaution I also send my connecting rods to Brian Miller to have them bored for bearings.

 

[Hydriv]

I would suggest ordering the rebuild kit first. I have ordered numerous rebuild kits from ebay seller bakt4kids. Always great service and quick delivery. The only reason I suggest ordering first is because some of the kits he sells are metric. .010 over piston is .25mm over piston. The machine shop I use (Wilkerson's in Springfield, IL) wont bore a block without piston and rings. They just want to make sure piston to wall clearance is correct.
Just as an extra precaution I also send my connecting rods to Brian Miller to have them bored for bearings.

Suppose that Wilkerson's examine a K-321 block that I bring them and then tell me that they THINK the bore will clean up at 20 over? So, on their advice, I order in a 20 over kit and hand it over to Wilkerson's. They put the block into the boring mill and take it to 20 over but discover a flaw that is not acceptable. So they put the boring bar through the cylinder again and now the cylinder cleans up at 30 over.. OR.... it does not clean up at 30 over and now sleeving the cylinder is the only option to save the block. That would take the bore back to zero. Either way.....the purchased kit now needs to be returned.....at my expense for shipping in both directions.

Did i miss anything here?

Even without boring the rods for insert bearings, the Kohler K engine will deliver at least 2000 hours of use if you just change the oil when you should and follow the servicing set out in the Kohler manual. Even at 100 hours per year, that's 20 years of use after a rebuild. And there are hundreds of thousands of K engines out there that have experience at least that many hours and quite often even more. Yes.....Brian Miller's mods are a great idea if you are building a Puller engine but are they really necessary to just cut grass and blow snow?

Not in this guy's opinion.

 

[bob_hefley]

Tom,

In my opinion you did. I have never had the machine shop advise me on the size of the overboring needed. I measure the bore myself. If measured correctly and going by the biggest measurment you can order the correct overhaul kit and and have everything you need to take to the machine shop.

And a note about the rod. I agree that installing an insert in the rod is not crucial, but I like the idea of a bearing on the crank.

 

[Hydriv]

C'mon now Bob.......is that fair? :lolno:

Most people who own one of these tractors don't even know how to properly measure the bore....let alone have the tools needed to carry out that process. They have to rely upon the local engine builder/machine shop to do that for them. And if they do so, then they put the burden onto the shop when it comes to errors.

 

[Rockdog]

I'd agree with Toms logic on this - BUT I'd ask the shop which way they'd suggest. I know with some old chromed snowmobile cylinders I'd have a pro check them out before I bought pistons on my own (that can get WAYYYY expensive).

I dont think I'd put a bearing in the rod of one of these for their intended use. Pulling tractors spend pretty much their entire life at high load and speed conditions.

 

[animalsonly]

I had posted on the 3rd that I ordered a puller from harbor freight. I have not received my package so I tracked it. It's ETA is may 16th. 13 days to deliver! I'll never order from them again. Do all of you have this problem with harbor freight and fedex?

 

[Billygoat]

No, HF is about 40 miles from here. My BIL goes that way at least once a week. :thumbup: